[GJM] Is Money Obsolete?

[Dan Parker]

Thanks for the great poem Richard. For money,
experiments in Russia on a large scale and Israeli (kibbutzim)
on a small scale, show that it is too early to eliminate
the accounting of money from a sociological perspective.

Kibbutzim members would leave their air conditioners
going all day, waste tons of food etc. because they were
not held personally responsible (until reforms fixed this).

Remember, all it takes is one to ruin things, even if the
great majority are inwardly driven to do the right thing.
That one person leads to the old 80/20 split, where 20%
of the people end up doing 80% of the work.

This could well be a reminder that accounting (and the
symbol of money) will always be necessary from
an environmental perspective (basic 'tragedy of the
commons' stuff).

Regards
Dan

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Richard D. Foley
To: Discussion Forum for Global Justice
Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 7:20 PM
Subject: Re: [GJM] Is Money Obsolete?


See attached poem in pdf "3Death to Money.pdf" by Richard Foley






Steve Consilvio wrote:



On Mar 11, 2007, at 8:24 AM, discussion-request at globaljusticemovement.net 
wrote:
Dan Parker wrote:

As well, as to say I'm wrong in my assessement because *just labour*
is necessary to make the difference is akin to saying to someone that
their life has no value (i.e. the person spending most of their waking hours
at work now).


There is not a problem with anybody's labor, per se, but how we "value" 
labor (which determines what we value.) Elvis Presley, for example, earns 
$20,000.00 an hour, even though he is dead, because of the privileges 
certain people get for their TYPE of work above the labor of a different 
type. We cannot be a society "where all men are created equal," where 
privileges like this are regarded as "commonsense," and are imbedded in the 
law.


To put it another way, it is the accounting system that is nuts, not the 
people. The people are only destructive because it is impossible to make 
your numbers balance, and destructive (of others and the environment) 
behaviors are the most profitable.


"We, us, and them" are all the same person. Everyone gets paid by an 
institutional organization, either directly or indirectly by churches and 
NGO's, Government or businesses. The individual can only get money AFTER it 
flows through one of these organizations, and after it flows out of the 
Federal Reserve. However, "wealth" is created by labor, not by 
organizations. An organization cannot create wealth, it can only "organize" 
human labor. Money, and profit are not wealth itself, they are just numbers 
within the accounting system.


Because of consumption, most wealth (labor) is consumed immediately, but the 
accounting system endures significantly longer, (unforgiven debts, etc.,) 
because profit is a numerical transaction, and people want to retain 
"advantageous" numbers. With the persistence of debt and poverty, there is 
also the persistence of Inflation within the accounting system as well. In 
my view, it is Inflation that is driving everyone to destructive behaviors 
of self-survival. (The Interest Mechanism) The only way to escape rising 
costs of living is to shift these costs to someone else (and thus to another 
institution.) We all end up playing the part of Scrooge, but we are battling 
a million other Scooges. There is no way anybody can win in the long term 
because it is impossible to cost-shift perpetually. The million Scrooges 
(and inflation) will always win. Everybody and every institution gets to 
experience loss. Thus, the system is rigged to make everyone a loser. The 
appearance of winners and losers is an illusion. Those moving up will 
eventually lose, and those that endure the most are those with government 
privileges (artists and inventors and landlords,) but they still have to 
live in an inflationary economy with increasing levels of paranoia and 
pollution. They cannot escape the blowback, either.


Inflation is related to all our political and social and environmental 
problems. Why do the numbers grow? If the organizations have a budget 
crisis, then the people must have one as well. Rather than seeing inflation 
as a separate phenomenon of "the marketplace" we should see it as a result 
of the marketplace. Since inflation is a man-made phenomenon, the question 
then is how? In fact, it is not just Interest, but it is profit as well that 
creates inflation. Both involve the math 2+2=5. (A bust is when 5=2+2) The 
battle of the Scrooges cannot end until we change what we "value" and how we 
value things. All labor must be regarded as equal if men are to be equal.


Another way to look at it: We are all suffering equally in a system that 
doesn't work because we share common ideas. If we change our ideas in regard 
to the thing that makes us suffer (money) then we can all enjoy the 
beneficial changes equally. Using money as an incentive (pollution credits, 
bribes, punishment,) simply perpetuates the importance of money and the need 
for money downstream. We need to get back to the idea of organizing labor 
for the common good and commonwealth, but it needs to be a change the 
individual can do without an institution, because the institutions are 
powerless just like everyone else.


The net effect is that we are all paying for the sins of previous 
generations. They indoctrinated us into their madness (as they were by their 
parents.) We can either repeat the same mistakes or correct them for the 
benefit of the next generation. One thing is sure, if the individual is 
unwilling to change, then there can be no change in society. In the case of 
Interest, people only need to change how they handle their surplus. It is a 
very easy change to make, since in most cases the money is already at risk. 
People need to risk changing the world, rather than just gambling 
pointlessly. The individual has to lead, not the institutions.


peace,
Steve Consilvio
www.behappyandfree.com



_______________________________________________
Discussion mailing list
Discussion at globaljusticemovement.net
http://globaljusticemovement.net/mailman/listinfo/discussion_globaljusticemovement.net




_______________________________________________
Discussion mailing list
Discussion at globaljusticemovement.net
http://globaljusticemovement.net/mailman/listinfo/discussion_globaljusticemovement.net




No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 268.18.8/714 - Release Date: 3/8/2007 
10:58 AM