[GJM] Steve to Stephen [was Announcement: American Monetary Institute conference]

[W. Curtiss Priest]

Dear Steve and Stephen,

I want to thank Steve for making a vital point, that issues
concerning the stability of economies and the distribution
of wealth, require that we think further than "simply a
medium of exchange."

I also wish to thank Steve for his brashness (I've copied
in his reply for folk who didn't receive it, below.)

What happens to some of us who recognize the full range
of murky issues surrounding money, capital, and debt is
when we become aware, we read a whole lot of books about
these subjects, including the various published folk 
who see issues and conspiracy, such as Griffith, Greider,
Davidson/Rees-Mogg, Batra, to name only a few.

Here, at CITS, we have over five hundred volumes in our
library on this general subject.  There are hundreds of
books written simply about foul play by folk from KPMG to
the various funds, say, Drexel Burnham Lambert, and, at
this moment, various "hedge funds" are concocting schemes
to bilk trillions from the system, and will be the fodder
of future books.

What appears to be the "science of money" quickly becomes
the "art of illusion."

So, when some of us wake up, we want to shake trees and
bring all these matters to someone's attention.  So,
I have written the CITS Capital & Debt Watch for over
ten years.  One of the first issues resulted from my visit
to view Roger Ward Babson's papers at Babson College (put
"Curtiss Priest" "Roger Ward Babson" into http://groups.google.com )

Meanwhile, while I, and others, have made various, correct
predictions, for example, see in "groups:"

	"Curtiss Priest" "why the dollar will dive" (May, 2002)

all I know for sure is that my Euros have gone up by 38%.

I mentioned gold and silver in that same newsletter.

All I really know for sure is gold was $300 at that time
and now is at $650 and silver was $4.05 at that time, and
now is at $12.60

Did any of you join me?  I don't know.

Further, meanwhile, "the street" has been gambling away
on a house-collaterized-debt consumer spree of around $1 trillion
in the last few years, multiply by 7 for "going around," and
thus a $7 trillion dollar impetus to the US economy.

This debt spree is screeching to a halt, and so, this $7
trillion dollar impetus will be "removed" -- what do you
think the result will be?  The DOW will probably go up today,
even though it "should be" at 3000.  And, I am not even
talking about the "spillover effects" of the sub-prime
lending market.  Add that to the cauldron.

But, you see, very few people want to listen to even
"simple reasoning."  They would rather "get rich" by 
following the crowd.

Now, returning to the books.  Well, the books cite crash
after crash resulting from folk doing exactly that --
following the crowd.

You'd think those books would make a difference.  But, I
sense they, at best, a psychotherapy for those of us
resisting that "crowd mentality."

Whichever, let's at the least take good notes for an
inevitable "reckoning" as people will then, at least, ask
"what happened?" and perhaps (like in Groundhog Day), we'll
finally get it right.

Regards,

W. Curtiss Priest, Ph.D.
Editor, CITS Capital & Debt Watch

Subject: Re: Announcement: American Monetary Institute conference
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 01:52:14 -0400 From: Steve Consilvio
<steve at behappyandfree.com> Reply-To: cyber-soc at topica.com To: AMI
<ami at taconic.net> CC: "List, Cyberspace Society"
<cyber-soc at topica.com>, "List, Debt" <Debt at topica.com>, "list,
Federal-Debts" <federal-debts at topica.com>, "List, Discussion Forum for
Global Justice Movement" <Discussion at globaljusticemovement.net>
References: 1 , 2 , 3

Dear Stephen,

Thank you for providing the link to your recent presentation to the 
Greens. I have been wanting to get a better understanding of your 
ideas, and that was a good review.

I hope you won't mind some constructive criticism. I'm just going to 
list them off from my notes, so they may seem a little choppy and 
blunt, but they are meant kindly.

1. The changes you recommend do not expect any changes in the 
behaviors of individuals. Most reforms forget what Gandhi taught us: 
for change to take place, it must occur at the individual level 
first. The marketplace of buying and selling for profit (in contrast 
to a marketplace of trading evenly) continues unabated.

2. Fiat money by the government is the same as fiat money by a bank. 
Changing who issues the money doesn't really change anything.

3. The lack of transparency in the government is equally 
problematical as the lack of transparency in banking.

4. It doesn't matter where you put the money, a thief will try to 
steal it wherever it is. The same is true of corruption from the 
inside. The bank is a lot smaller than the government.

5. Inflation is the "re-numbering" of goods. We see this at the gas 
pump regularly. Nothing in your reforms address the way people do 
business. (Binary Economics at least makes an attempt.)

6. Inflation is caused by profit, not by manufacturing goods. A good 
exists regardless of the value applied to it, and the same is true of 
labor. If we cannot afford to fix our infrastructure it is because we
have assigned values to things so that we cannot afford them. Even
the rich pay high prices.

7. Your dismissal of Marx was startling, and Aristotle believed that 
slavery was part of the natural order of mankind. I would be careful 
about quoting Aristotle as some sage regarding money. Most people 
want a peaceful and equitable society, but they are not willing to 
give up their own advantages to do so. (See #1)

8. Too much of your presentation is spent demonizing or worshiping 
certain thinkers, rather than taking their ideas and analyzing them 
within the context of their times. You grossly misunderstand Robert 
Morris, who is really the lynchpin of American history.

9. There was nothing glorious about the American Revolution. It was a
result of the economic practices of the time, just as Iraq is today,
and the battles between Sparta and Athens were then. It is the
inability to trade fairly that is at the root of the problem, money
is just an abstraction of the transaction. Money invites in a third
party, it doesn't matter who coins the money (private bank or 
government,) the fiat money complicates the transaction, even though 
it is supposed to make it go more smoothly.

10. The Great Depression was not good for anybody. The Fed is the 
First National Bank. Painting the house and rearranging the furniture
doesn't mean much. The shifting from state to federal banking is also
minor in the big picture. Decentralized bumbling decisions are not
qualitatively different than centralized bumbling decisions. The Fed
bumbled into The Great Depression, bumbled out, and is still bumbling
today, but they did not create the intellectual agreement we call
money. That has been around for thousands of years.

11. Wampum may have been a better way of creating an exchange 
species. If everybody could coin their own money, maybe a free market
could actually work. Then the decision to accept the wampum or not
would be based on the personal relationships of the people involved,
rather than the weight of law and "legal tender." It would render
both the bank and the government moot.

12. Short-selling the Mark before WWII is similar to what America is 
doing to Iran today. Chances are a similar attempt at ill-gotten 
wealth was behind WWI as well. As long as there are national 
currencies, war will probably continue. Your reforms simply don't 
have the reach that you hope they will.

13. The coining of money is not nearly as important as how we use the 
money.

14. The belief in a central bank was tied directly to the belief that 
it would make war easier to finance. Not surprisingly, it has made it
easier for the central government to conduct war. The Founding 
Fascists (Paine, Jefferson and Franklin among them) got their wish. 
You underestimate the role of fear and pride in your economic 
history. Money is like a cancer in our imagination.

15. You use fear as a justification for your ideas. The threat of 
nuclear annihilation is combined with the idea that only a central 
government can coin money or build a levy. The levy was built so it 
would make the land more profitable. We are arrogant in thinking we 
can control nature, and we are not helpless if we don't have a head 
moron to genuflect to. (The global warming brigade shares the same 
arrogance- now liberals stand on street corners saying that the sky 
is falling. Pollution is not the same as global warming.) Fear 
arrives in many many layers; the inflation and concentration of 
wealth (which are mathematical phenomenons, not a conspiracy) lead 
people to search for blame, rather than for answers. Blaming the rich
is an empty idea; there is more going on than just luck or ambition.
Economics is a mathematical science.

There are, of course, a lot of things about your presentation that I 
found intriguing. There is a lot more that I would like to know about
some issues. It is obviously a very condensed version of the material
your book covers. I'd really like to know more about fractional
reserves and what you meant by Sparta "finding out." It is important
to understand how the Fed thinks so we can teach them how wrong they
are.

In closing, you can be a lot more radical in your thinking. Don't 
stop testing your own ideas while studying the ideas of others. There
was a time when I blamed everything on Robert Morris, but now I see
him as he truly was, and his tragic story is a good metaphor for 
everything we have experienced since. Good intentions don't always 
lead to good results. I am not a victim, I am also part of the 
problem, as we all are. Keep testing.

peace, steve consilvio www.behappyandfree.com

peace, steve

On Jul 18, 2007, at 8:55 PM, AMI wrote:

> Dear Curtis and All, > Thanks for your email Curtis. I'm answering
so that the various > people on the list you copied to do not assume
that I or the > American Monetary Institute supports what you call
"Binary > Economics." We don't. Michael Hudsons new book discussing
this will > be interesting to you. > Sincerely, > Stephen Zarlenga >
Director, American Monetary Institute > P.S. You and your friends can
see what the AMI does propose by > checking out my recent July 12th
one and a quarter hour talk at the > Green Party's National
Convention, by going to http:// >
www.monetary.org/greenpartytalk.html > > > W. Curtiss Priest wrote: >
>> [reader: see "Fraud, Farce and Foreclosures" below] >> >> Dear
Steve, >> >> Stephen Zarlenga is, at the least, a positive force. >>
>> Yes, those who work for the government are much too >> comfortable.
A college friend retired at age 55 from >> the GAO, wealthy and well
pensioned. >> >> Yes, few at MIT, etc., understand. But, do read >>
Kindleberger, who, prematurely I sense, saw the plague >> of cycles.
>> >> A solution? Pay the proceeds of productivity gains back >> to
the workers. (see "Binary Economics," "Social Credit") >> >> So, a
good role for government. Do that transfer. >> >> Regards, >> >>
Curtiss >> >> Steve Consilvio wrote: >> >>> Dear
financially-concerned, >>> >>> Consider attending the 3rd annual AMI
Monetary Reform Conference >>> in Chicago at Roosevelt Unversity,
Sept. 27-30: >>> >>> http://www.monetary.org/2007conference.html >>>
>>> AMI, headed by Stephen Zarlenga, is a needed voice amidst >>> the
ignorance and confusion about money. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Curtiss
>>> Editor, CITS Capital & Debt Watch >>> >>> Hi Curtiss, >>> >>> From
what I can tell, Stephen Zarlenga is also ignorant and confused >>>
about money. He does, however, approach it with an open-mind and a >>>
critical eye that is lacking in too many corners. Most people just >>>
want to accumulate wealth, not understand it. >>> >>> What follows is
a brief essay I wrote recently. Getting it >>> published >>> is
practically impossible, given what it says. But I think you >>> might
>>> agree that the biggest problem with money is the concept of money.
>>> MIT, by the way, along with Harvard and Yale, are one the biggest 
>>> and >>> original sources of the problem in modern times. >>> >>>
There is a huge gap between compassion and virtue that needs to be >>>
addressed. You are in the belly of the dragon. :-) >>> >>> peace, >>>
steve consilvio >>> auburn, ma >>> 774-272-1430 >>>
www.behappyandfree.com >>> >>> Fraud, Farce and Foreclosures >>> by
Steve Consilvio >>> >>> It should not be to hard to get everyone to
agree that the State >>> creates winners and losers. Bill Gates is the
richest man in the >>> world primarily because of sales to the
government. "We the People," >>> pay taxes, and that money, in huge
sums, goes to the coffers of >>> Microsoft. This is similarly true of
Haliburton, Bechtel, >>> builders of >>> schools, suppliers, the
teacher unions and state workers. As a >>> entreprenuer, I am supposed
to think this is great. There are >>> lots of >>> government
contracts available, and I have the opportunity to get >>> rich >>>
by impoverishing my neighbor. As a citizen, however, I am a >>>
victim of >>> the same system from which I feed. Thomas Paine
described this same >>> exact situation 230 years ago when he wrote:
>>> >>> "Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in
its >>> best >>> state is but a necessary evil in its worst state an
intolerable one; >>> for when we suffer, or are exposed to the same
miseries by a >>> government, which we might expect in a country
without >>> government, our >>> calamities is heightened by
reflecting that we furnish the means by >>> which we suffer!
Government, like dress, is the badge of lost >>> innocence; the
palaces of kings are built on the ruins of the bowers >>> of
paradise." >>> >>> It is true that history repeats itself, and now we
have come full >>> circle, again. >>> >>> The Sunday Telegram
(Worcester, MA) of June 24 had a front page >>> regarding the
investment returns of state employees, and the front >>> page of the
Business section was about the loss of the American >>> Dream >>> and
the rising rates of foreclosures. My goal is to show you how >>> these
two events are historically and mathematically related, and >>> why
>>> planes fly into banks. The events of 9/11, the ultra-cost of >>>
paranoid >>> security, and the impossible situation for young people
who are >>> being >>> preyed upon by lenders, universities, mortgage
companies, >>> corporations >>> and even their own parents is
creating a marketplace that is not >>> sustainable. Unlike colonial
times, however, there is no King to >>> blame. The only people we can
blame is ourselves. >>> >>> The simplest way to understand the problem
is that the central bank >>> both creates a national currency and
devalues the currency by the >>> way >>> it manages it. Since taxes
are to be paid in the same currency, the >>> perpetual burden of
inflation is placed on the working people. All >>> the efficiency in
the world fails, and eventually the best and only >>> job available is
to work for the government, either directly or >>> indirectly. Numbers
have become so overwhelmingly important that we >>> manufacture goods
just to throw them away. >>> >>> The government swells as the people
get progressively poorer, >>> creating >>> two distinct classes of
people and two types of buildings. We have >>> buildings to hold large
groups, but not for people to live in. >>> Government workers have
pensions, health insurance, and cost of >>> living >>> increases,
while the working people are ever burdened with paying >>> for >>>
these benefits. The working people lose their houses while >>>
government >>> workers and suppliers plan early retirement and
purchase a second >>> home. The government eventually becomes an
advocate for idle >>> gluttony, supporting infrastructure improvements
for golf courses, >>> ball parks, dinner and art districts. Taking
care of the rich >>> becomes >>> the only industry available, which
eventually leads to men like >>> Donald >>> Trump building luxury
condominiums and casinos. The private sector >>> becomes corrupted by
the public sector. >>> >>> Inflation, however, provides no escape,
even for the rich. Their >>> high >>> lifestyle comes with a high
overhead, and it is as impossible to >>> maintain a rich lifestyle as
it is a poor one. Inflation eats >>> everyone alive, rich and poor,
but the burden falls >>> disproportionately >>> on the poorest. >>>
>>> Fraud makes the situation worse, but that is just the rich
stealing >>> from the rich. It is the expectations behind the fraud
that is a >>> farce. People want to believe that 2+2=5 when they
invest >>> (boom), and >>> are surprised to discover that 5=2+2 as
well (bust.) Math has no >>> mercy, and the formula in your favor also
works against you. >>> Whatever >>> gain is made must come at someone
else's expense, and eventually it >>> will be made at your or your
children's expense. >>> >>> Profit is a system of cost-shifting, not a
system of trade. It >>> is our >>> failure to trade that creates a
situation where planes fly into the >>> misnamed "trade" building.
Even the United Nations is built around >>> the concept of profit,
intellectual property and the bias of rich >>> nations. It represents
a political farce layered upon a mathematical >>> farce, the same as
for national and state governments. >>> >>> The gap between the rich
and the poor is not a mystery; the system >>> itself creates both the
consolidation of wealth as well as the >>> inflation. Both results are
hard-wired into the currency system and >>> the situation has
reappeared here because the US Constitution >>> recreated the same
financial attributes as the previous >>> constitutional >>> monarch.
The perpetual budget crisis is a world-wide and historical >>>
phenomenon because money has always been understood, coined, and >>>
used >>> in the same predatory way for profit, rather than for trade.
>>> >>> Fraud is telling a lie. A farce is believing a lie, thinking
it is >>> true. There is no one person to blame, we are all
participants >>> in the >>> farce. The faith in profit is the same as
the faith in a King as >>> superior to all men was previously. Profit,
taxes and inflation are >>> all intimately linked. Each one drives the
other. >>> >>> Our problems do require intellectual rigor and moral
courage to >>> solve. Fortunately, history also repeats itself in a
positive >>> regard, >>> too. We can have a renaissance; the choice
is ours. We must >>> simply >>> combine our compassion with the
correct strategy. >>> >>> Many are living in Hell right now, and there
is a good chance that >>> many of us will be going to Hell, too, and
taking our children with >>> us, as we teach and engage in
profit-taking, capital gains, interest >>> and usury. The children
both pay for and repeat the sins of their >>> fathers. Funny how that
works, eh? The apple doesn't fall far from >>> the tree. The first lie
ever told was to eat the apple, the second >>> lie ever told was to
sell them for profit. >>> >>> As Isaiah wrote, "If you are willing and
obedient, you will eat the >>> best from the land, but if you resist
and rebel, you will be >>> devoured >>> by the sword." >>> >>> Once a
problem is properly diagnosed it is easy to fix. >>> Unfortunately,
our new Governor, like leaders and entrepreneurs >>> before >>> him,
has not made any choices that indicates he understands the >>>
problem. >>> >> >> >



-- 


	   W. Curtiss Priest, Director, CITS
      Center for Information, Technology & Society
         466 Pleasant St., Melrose, MA  02176
   781-662-4044  BMSLIB at MIT.EDU http://Cybertrails.org