[GJM] Fw: Re: An Evolutionary Conversation with Barbara Marx Hubbard

[marguerite hampton]

I will comment interspersed below: 

From: Chuck Tedesco
Date: 02/13/07 16:12:05
To: marguerite hampton
Subject: Re: An Evolutionary Conversation with Barbara Marx Hubbard
 
  
Dear Marguerite, you noted in your posting today that..."At some point, we
are all going to come face to face with the fact that human consciouness is
a biological function, just as is the process of digesting food."  
 
We are of a greatly varying opinion on that.  Your statement implies that
there is no such thing as spirituality.  No evolution of the soul as opposed
to the physical.  Despite the "evidences" of science, expansion or growth of
consciousness has little to do with biological function other than that such
growth is inhibited when we do not take care of our bodies.  Consciousness
evolution has mostly to do with the extent to which we disassociate from the
nagging, unsatisfied mind, allowing heart and intuition to guide our
thoughts and actions. 

eco:  What we consider to be "spirituality" is really the bioelectromagnetic
energy/information 
which constitutes the human "information field".  It is part of our 
biological makeup".  What science is able to prove today is that there is no
real difference between mind and matter except as our senses perceive it. 
And, that the "frequency vibrations" between what is considered to be "mind
or matter" vary considerably. The "new science"  verifies this both by what
can be observed 
visually through new and more powerful microscopes and measured by more
powerful instrumentation.  

Science does indeed have much to teach us, including some things about how
to better understand that which can be explained.  What science refuses to
acknowledge, however, is that there are some things which, in attempting to
explain them, simply sap our physical and spiritual strength.  Some things
are simply meant to remain mysteries and to be accepted as they are. 
On the dogma issue, it is easy to confuse religion and spirituality.  In the
"reality" of our current world, most religion is inherently anti-spiritual
because it dictates dogma which is commanded to be accepted if one is a 
true member" of most religions.  There is a great difference between that
and wisdom which is found within and then trusted, based upon intuition,
gut-feeling and dthe feeling of a true connection with the infinite. 

eco:  I find the above to be exceedingly abstract and without basis. What
would be the purpose of anything remaining "a mystery" and what, may I ask
is "the infinite"? 
 
The great mystic guru, Osho, said that it is good for men to become more
like women and for women to become more like men.

eco:  Hmmm - since we each have elements of masculinity and feminity within
us, it appears that what we need to do is to "balance" them appropriately,
not to seek to be more like one or the other. .   
 
Likewise, it is up to scientists to learn of the value of intuition and
heart and that which is best left unexplained but accepted.  And it is up to
the spiritualist to recognize the value in what science gives and continues
to give us. 

eco:  From where I sit, both intuition and what we consider to be "heart"
(felt) have very valid  scientifically-based explanations -- there is no
longer a "ghost in the machine". 


On 2/13/07, 



marguerite hampton <ecopilgrim at aabol.com> wrote: 
Thanks to Mary and Janaia for this message, and to Mary for asking what I
might have to say.

IMHO, on the way to the forum, Ms. Hubbard got stuck in the "spirit world" 
and consequently, caught up in "divinization".  Making information "divine"
attributes its source to something or someone "outside of ourselves" -- some
mystical god or superhuman being.  This information then becomes 
institutionalized" as part of church doctrine and thus implanted in the
theological foundation of the minds of "believers" as "dogma". Once
implanted, this type of "crazy-making" can go in a legitimized and 
unobstructed manner. And woe be to anyone who challenges
"the word of God". In this manner, divinization legitimizes such things as
mental illness and war.
And, although I feel the intentions are good, I also feel that the 
Conversations with God"  series
tends to hang us on the same hook.

At some point, we are all going to come face to face with the fact that
human consciouness is a biological function, just as is the process of 
digesting food.  At this point, my mind jumps to the title
of psychologist Fritz Perls book:  "In and Out of the Garbage Pail" and his
phrase "garbage in - garbage out".

In order to get out of the bind that religion has placed us in, the only 
place to turn for legitimacy/authenticity is to science.

I am following this post with one forwarded by good friend and new list
member Chuck Tedesco also known as Carlo Ami, entitled:  "Praying From the 
Heart" which has a substantial
scientific basis.

Comments?

warm regards,

marguerite  .
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